|
Post by bellegold89 on Apr 13, 2014 5:05:37 GMT -8
bellegold89 - The whole imprinting thing is very sexist. But I'm just trying to make the illogical somewhat logical and I don't think I do a very good job explaining myself. You're right about the fact that the imprints have a choice about whether or not to stay and be an anchor to the wolves. I think I get what you are saying but do the imprints really have a choice weather to stay around? I mean the only imprintee who didn't live in Forks was Kim and she moved home within a year of being imprinted on. I completely agree with them having no excuse for their behaviours. Especially Quil and Jacob who are grooming children.
|
|
|
Post by Lady of Himring on Apr 25, 2014 14:41:52 GMT -8
The tales told within her tribe are just mythology to her. Emily is from another tribe. She fell in 'love' with Sam by having conversations with Leah on the phone on how awesome he was.
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on Apr 27, 2014 13:38:16 GMT -8
The tales told within her tribe are just mythology to her. Emily is from another tribe. She fell in 'love' with Sam by having conversations with Leah on the phone on how awesome he was. That's even worse.
|
|
|
Post by Lady of Himring on Apr 29, 2014 20:13:15 GMT -8
Emily is from another tribe. She fell in 'love' with Sam by having conversations with Leah on the phone on how awesome he was. That's even worse. It gets worst: The reason why Emily rejected Sam wasn't born out of familiar love and respect towards Leah. But because she was playing hard to get.
And yes, that is Meyer's reply.
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on May 2, 2014 14:20:04 GMT -8
It gets worst: The reason why Emily rejected Sam wasn't born out of familiar love and respect towards Leah. But because she was playing hard to get.
And yes, that is Meyer's reply.
Wait, so something that scarred her for life is done because she's doing something many women do by playing hard to get? And because of something so trivial, Sam did that and she deserved it?
|
|
|
Post by Chaotic Neutral on May 2, 2014 16:15:52 GMT -8
It gets worst: The reason why Emily rejected Sam wasn't born out of familiar love and respect towards Leah. But because she was playing hard to get.
And yes, that is Meyer's reply.
Wait, so something that scarred her for life is done because she's doing something many women do by playing hard to get? And because of something so trivial, Sam did that and she deserved it? Yep. And it all worked out because she forgave him and helped HIM get over it and made HIM feel better about having scarred her for life. Plus he felt bad about it. That fixes everything, right?
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on May 4, 2014 12:00:22 GMT -8
Wait, so something that scarred her for life is done because she's doing something many women do by playing hard to get? And because of something so trivial, Sam did that and she deserved it? Yep. And it all worked out because she forgave him and helped HIM get over it and made HIM feel better about having scarred her for life. Plus he felt bad about it. That fixes everything, right? Right I mean she's scarred for life, but poor Sam - the guilt!! Oh how much pity I feel! He is obviously the victim.
|
|
|
Post by Chaotic Neutral on May 4, 2014 19:32:50 GMT -8
Yep. And it all worked out because she forgave him and helped HIM get over it and made HIM feel better about having scarred her for life. Plus he felt bad about it. That fixes everything, right? Right I mean she's scarred for life, but poor Sam - the guilt!! Oh how much pity I feel! He is obviously the victim. Quite true! I mean, sure, he scarred her for life in a fit of anger over her telling him no, but he was completely the worse off of the two. It's a good thing Emily worked to help him recover from the trauma of attacking her after he offered to kill himself to make it up to her. That's love, right? Of course it is! And the way he regularly kisses the scars he gave her isn't creepy in the least. Is it just me or is anyone else starting to choke on the sarcasm?
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on May 7, 2014 4:35:31 GMT -8
Right I mean she's scarred for life, but poor Sam - the guilt!! Oh how much pity I feel! He is obviously the victim. Quite true! I mean, sure, he scarred her for life in a fit of anger over her telling him no, but he was completely the worse off of the two. It's a good thing Emily worked to help him recover from the trauma of attacking her after he offered to kill himself to make it up to her. That's love, right? Of course it is! And the way he regularly kisses the scars he gave her isn't creepy in the least. Is it just me or is anyone else starting to choke on the sarcasm? Yeah maybe we should stop. But at least we know it's true love that way right? I mean she's even got permanent proof of his true love! Lucky Emily!
|
|
|
Post by Chaotic Neutral on May 7, 2014 5:12:26 GMT -8
Quite true! I mean, sure, he scarred her for life in a fit of anger over her telling him no, but he was completely the worse off of the two. It's a good thing Emily worked to help him recover from the trauma of attacking her after he offered to kill himself to make it up to her. That's love, right? Of course it is! And the way he regularly kisses the scars he gave her isn't creepy in the least. Is it just me or is anyone else starting to choke on the sarcasm? Yeah maybe we should stop. But at least we know it's true love that way right? I mean she's even got permanent proof of his true love! Lucky Emily! I think that it's this inconsistency here that makes me despise Emily so much. On the one hand, she technically betrayed her own cousin and reported "best friend" and we have no real indication whatsoever of the two even having continued contact or reconciling aside from Emily's insult to injury by asking Leah to be a bridesmaid. But on the other hand, Emily is also technically supposed to be the victim here due to Sam's anger causing him to scar her for life and she's stuck with him for the rest her of life as well, but she seems to take to her new position whole-heartedly and with joy--which really just creeps me out more. It's like "sure, I'm betraying my best friend and family member to get with her ex who attacked me when I told him no and scarred me for life, but it's okay because I was just playing hard to get and it just proves how much he loves me!" I feel kind of bad about feeling this way about her, since she is technically a victim but it's hard for me to see her that way when she doesn't act like a victim or even a survivor of such abuse, she acts like a Stepford Wife, and it's hard for me to relate to that.
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on May 8, 2014 6:28:26 GMT -8
Yeah maybe we should stop. But at least we know it's true love that way right? I mean she's even got permanent proof of his true love! Lucky Emily! I think that it's this inconsistency here that makes me despise Emily so much. On the one hand, she technically betrayed her own cousin and reported "best friend" and we have no real indication whatsoever of the two even having continued contact or reconciling aside from Emily's insult to injury by asking Leah to be a bridesmaid. But on the other hand, Emily is also technically supposed to be the victim here due to Sam's anger causing him to scar her for life and she's stuck with him for the rest her of life as well, but she seems to take to her new position whole-heartedly and with joy--which really just creeps me out more. It's like "sure, I'm betraying my best friend and family member to get with her ex who attacked me when I told him no and scarred me for life, but it's okay because I was just playing hard to get and it just proves how much he loves me!" I feel kind of bad about feeling this way about her, since she is technically a victim but it's hard for me to see her that way when she doesn't act like a victim or even a survivor of such abuse, she acts like a Stepford Wife, and it's hard for me to relate to that. Yes I mean he could have killed her but she's still the perfect little wife for him. Saying no to an imprinter clearly isn't an option. And these are portrayed as fantastic relationships. Yeah.
|
|
|
Post by Georgaina on Aug 23, 2014 5:37:57 GMT -8
As someone who got to about Step 3 with someone irl, I can say with all honesty that all the werewolf imprint stories feel familiar to the point where it feels very unsettling for me. But to be honest, this is where Stephenie's wonderfully crappy writing comes in: the Westermarck effect goes on a theory that if a child spends a lot of time with someone for 6 years, that child will not be able to ever fall in love with that person. This is how nature would draw out the negative side effect of incest, more than anything. Yet it is hilarious to think that Renesmee reaches maturity at age 7, a year after she will be unable to ever fall in love with him.
And then it hits you: since imprinting seems to cause obsession from the wolf side of the "arrangement", rape will probably not be out of the question of Renesmee or Claire were to try and get away from their zoophilic partners..
|
|
|
Post by arcanius on Aug 24, 2014 2:33:28 GMT -8
*que creepy music*
|
|
|
Post by Chaotic Neutral on Aug 24, 2014 20:12:11 GMT -8
As someone who got to about Step 3 with someone irl, I can say with all honesty that all the werewolf imprint stories feel familiar to the point where it feels very unsettling for me. But to be honest, this is where Stephenie's wonderfully crappy writing comes in: the Westermarck effect goes on a theory that if a child spends a lot of time with someone for 6 years, that child will not be able to ever fall in love with that person. This is how nature would draw out the negative side effect of incest, more than anything. Yet it is hilarious to think that Renesmee reaches maturity at age 7, a year after she will be unable to ever fall in love with him. And then it hits you: since imprinting seems to cause obsession from the wolf side of the "arrangement", rape will probably not be out of the question of Renesmee or Claire were to try and get away from their zoophilic partners.. I'll believe it. For all the "true love" and "soul mates" that imprinting is supposed to be, that hardly stopped Sam from attacking Emily out of anger. Intentional, directed anger in response to her rejection that not only scarred her for life but could have blinded her or killed her outright. Yeah...suddenly the thoughts of Quil or any of the wolves murdering Claire's parents if they tried to keep him away from her don't sound that far off....
|
|
|
Post by Georgaina on Aug 25, 2014 14:23:38 GMT -8
As someone who got to about Step 3 with someone irl, I can say with all honesty that all the werewolf imprint stories feel familiar to the point where it feels very unsettling for me. But to be honest, this is where Stephenie's wonderfully crappy writing comes in: the Westermarck effect goes on a theory that if a child spends a lot of time with someone for 6 years, that child will not be able to ever fall in love with that person. This is how nature would draw out the negative side effect of incest, more than anything. Yet it is hilarious to think that Renesmee reaches maturity at age 7, a year after she will be unable to ever fall in love with him. And then it hits you: since imprinting seems to cause obsession from the wolf side of the "arrangement", rape will probably not be out of the question of Renesmee or Claire were to try and get away from their zoophilic partners.. I'll believe it. For all the "true love" and "soul mates" that imprinting is supposed to be, that hardly stopped Sam from attacking Emily out of anger. Intentional, directed anger in response to her rejection that not only scarred her for life but could have blinded her or killed her outright. Yeah...suddenly the thoughts of Quil or any of the wolves murdering Claire's parents if they tried to keep him away from her don't sound that far off.... Funnily (erm.. kind of inappropriate word..) enough, I didn't even think about the possibility of them murdering people to get to 'em. As Snape would've said to Jacob's action to keep Renesmee: "You have risked the exposure of our world!" Also, knowing SMeyer, if they accidentally end up killing their "soul mate", they'd probably kill themselves.
|
|
|
Post by arcanius on Aug 25, 2014 14:52:36 GMT -8
^ Oh, oh, let me get a cheap shot here - and they'll attempt suicide by revealing themselves to humans so that they get killed by an angry mob, because datz more drahmaz!!!
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on Sept 4, 2014 4:52:46 GMT -8
As someone who got to about Step 3 with someone irl, I can say with all honesty that all the werewolf imprint stories feel familiar to the point where it feels very unsettling for me. But to be honest, this is where Stephenie's wonderfully crappy writing comes in: the Westermarck effect goes on a theory that if a child spends a lot of time with someone for 6 years, that child will not be able to ever fall in love with that person. This is how nature would draw out the negative side effect of incest, more than anything. Yet it is hilarious to think that Renesmee reaches maturity at age 7, a year after she will be unable to ever fall in love with him. And then it hits you: since imprinting seems to cause obsession from the wolf side of the "arrangement", rape will probably not be out of the question of Renesmee or Claire were to try and get away from their zoophilic partners.. I'll believe it. For all the "true love" and "soul mates" that imprinting is supposed to be, that hardly stopped Sam from attacking Emily out of anger. Intentional, directed anger in response to her rejection that not only scarred her for life but could have blinded her or killed her outright. Yeah...suddenly the thoughts of Quil or any of the wolves murdering Claire's parents if they tried to keep him away from her don't sound that far off.... Yes who know what they would do for 'twue luv!!!' in Meyer's scary world.
|
|
|
Post by arcanius on Sept 5, 2014 5:17:42 GMT -8
^ Now imagine for a sex that Twilight was a horror.
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on Sept 9, 2014 10:26:53 GMT -8
^ Now imagine for a sex that Twilight was a horror. ...not a big leap...
|
|
|
Post by arcanius on Sept 9, 2014 14:59:54 GMT -8
Would it be weird of me to say that if Twilight was intended as a horror it would have been pretty good
|
|
|
Post by Chaotic Neutral on Sept 10, 2014 23:13:16 GMT -8
^Not at all. It certainly would have been an improvement. I mean, these are creatures that are super strong, super fast, essentially (supposedly) unkillable, and are in no way deterred by any of the normal vampire weaknesses. You can't outrun them. You can't hide from them. You can't wait them out either as they can get you whether it's day or night. They can follow you anywhere and pretty much nothing can get in their way if they really want to kill you. And once they do kill you, no one would even suspect the real truth because everyone would just wave it off as an animal attack and they would be free to kill again. And again. They are unstoppable, uncatchable killers. Apparently the top of the food chain and all that. And what do they do with this?
They sit around in their fancy mansion and go to high school. I mean, it'd be like if the Predators decided to forego the whole "hunting" bit to play golf. Or Dracula decided to forego killing people and accruing power to play video games. True, both scenarios sound pretty funny actually, but they certainly lose a lot of the "fear" factor that originally made them so great. And that's Twilight--potential for a perfectly good joke that fell flat because it took itself too seriously and layered itself in needless drama and angst.
Seriously, what are these characters even so damn sad about? I've seen plenty of media that try to hit the point home that immortality is not all it's cracked up to be, but they at least explained HOW--losing family and loved ones to time/old age, mental instability due to prolonged life and constant influx of information, unable to be part of the world they're trying to protect or reach out to anyone, some hidden clause in the contract that doesn't give them youth or invulnerability, or hell even due to simple boredom. Okay, yeah, makes sense. But Twilight expresses none of those things. They're just immortal and whining about it. They don't at any point express sadness or remorse for the ones they lost or even that they MISS anyone from their previous lives. Hell, from the sounds of it for a few of them, they're happy the people they knew are dead. Mental instability, okay, we all know they each have some screw loose, but not in the context of the story. They're repeating high school and the dad's a doctor so being unable to be part of the world (and profiting off it for their own gain in the meantime) is no issue aside from their own intentional snooty "better than you" attitude that is (like with everything else) shown to have no fault. No hidden negative clause here--beauty, strength, speed, eternal youth, immortality unless someone manages to tear them to pieces which is expressed to be near impossible. The closest thing they could have is possibly boredom, but even then they have ways to deal with that--shopping, cooking, doctoring, repeating high school over and over, driving their cars really really fast on dirt roads, and stalking and kidnapping young girls.
Okay, rant aside: these are noted killers. All of them. They could be downright terrifying as serial killers. They could be downright awesome as a superhero team. Instead of either, they just...leech off society while looking down on said society. That doesn't make me either scared or impressed, that makes me despise these people and want them to die.
|
|
|
Post by Lady of Himring on Dec 5, 2014 19:17:31 GMT -8
^I agree, a horror story would be best for Twilight, but this is Meyer. The woman couldn't even finish Interview with the Vampire. I'll believe it. For all the "true love" and "soul mates" that imprinting is supposed to be, that hardly stopped Sam from attacking Emily out of anger. Intentional, directed anger in response to her rejection that not only scarred her for life but could have blinded her or killed her outright. Yeah...suddenly the thoughts of Quil or any of the wolves murdering Claire's parents if they tried to keep him away from her don't sound that far off.... Yes who know what they would do for 'twue luv!!!' in Meyer's scary world. I have always said that Meyer never really thought about the imprint coming across as creepy. Because it is creepy, that's not love, it's slavery in another form. You have a person whose will is completely gone and only want to please the other (the imprinter and the intended); as mentioned above, Sam went to see Emily to the hospital and said he'd throw himself on a bus if that would make her feel better. And now you have emotional guilt and blackmail. It's awful.
|
|
|
Post by valkyria on Dec 10, 2014 5:39:22 GMT -8
Quil and Claire is worst than Jacob/ Renesmee because Jacob won't watch over er and stuff, but yeah, it's still creepy.
|
|
|
Post by bellegold89 on Dec 14, 2014 11:26:31 GMT -8
Quil and Claire is worst than Jacob/ Renesmee because Jacob won't watch over er and stuff, but yeah, it's still creepy. To be fair, Bella's plan if the fight went badly was to send Renesmee away with Jacob. That's not disturbing at all.
|
|
|
Post by Lady of Himring on Dec 15, 2014 13:55:43 GMT -8
Quil and Claire is worst than Jacob/ Renesmee because Jacob won't watch over er and stuff, but yeah, it's still creepy. As Bellegold said above, Bella was ready to send Reneesme away with Jacob if the fight went wrong. And Edward goes so far as to call say: Farwell, my son.
If that's not creepy (Edward's basically giving the approval of their marriage when she is still a child/baby) I don't know what is. But in general the imprint is creepy and a form of twisted love that Meyer overplayed her hand and it's awful.
|
|