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Post by Blue Suede Shoes on Dec 14, 2010 12:33:50 GMT -8
Yeah, and what about her claiming that Alice would have been burned as a witch had she been born about 100 years earlier (meaning, during the effing 19th century)? I think she also said that Alice was given electric shocks during her time in the asylum, although they weren't even used when she was institutionalized. Isn't Alice originally from the United States? If so, she would never have been burned for witchcraft, even if she lived in, say, the 17th century. While some people have been executed for witchcraft, on this side of the pond they were hanged, not burned. (Burning was really seen as a punishment for heresy, not witchcraft per se, though these things sometimes overlapped.) Plus aside from the hysteria of 1692, people in what is now the United States were rarely convicted of witchcraft without having confessed, because it was otherwise almost impossible to prove under English evidentiary laws (these laws were not followed during the witch hysteria; most of the convictions of that period were not actually legally proper.) Unless Alice admitted she did it and intentionally caused harm by it, she would probably have been in no danger unless she lived in Salem or surrounding areas during one weird year. Most of those executed for witchcraft at other times were mentally ill and really believed they hurt people by magic. But of course if Meyer couldn't research the basics of her storyline, of course she couldn't research something like that. /used to work at an educational site in Historic Salem
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Post by vampirekites on Dec 14, 2010 13:22:22 GMT -8
100 years prior to 2005 is 1905, and there is NO WAY anyone would be accused of witchcraft in the 20th century. 100 years prior to that is 1805, where people still wouldn't have been accused of witchcraft. Insane, yes. A witch, not so much.
It's more of Smeyer trying to romanticize her story line with historical fallacies to make it more interesting. She must have not known that people who actually know about history, biology, and everything in between would read this and scrutinize it. Or she thought since it was "fiction" she'd get away with it. She really has no clue about anything, does she? Makes you wonder how she can function on a day to day basis.
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Post by Elentari on Dec 14, 2010 14:02:58 GMT -8
This fan tried to dodge that thing about Alice with saying that if "Meyer got right the European witch hunts, surely she is correct about American cases, too".
I also think her timeline on Cromwell's reign in England is off, too, and has some inconsistencies - and I'd like to know what Carlisle's father, an anglican vicar, would have been doing during the puritan time - and her claims that London had 1) witch hunts that time (I think that was Essex) or 2) sewers are also untrue. Also, I remember Wardo telling how Carlisle hid in a pile of rotting potatoes after he had been turned, and I'm not sure if potatoes had even been brought to Europe that time.
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limelightqueen
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Post by limelightqueen on Dec 17, 2010 22:41:26 GMT -8
So in Eclipse we hear the story of the third wife, the one who stabbed herself to save the tribe after the she-vamp was terrorizing them. Supposedly the blood distracted her. But seriously, she was terrorizing them- are we to believe that no one else was bleeding? SERIOUSLY?
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gisbon
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Post by gisbon on Dec 20, 2010 4:56:31 GMT -8
So in Eclipse we hear the story of the third wife, the one who stabbed herself to save the tribe after the she-vamp was terrorizing them. Supposedly the blood distracted her. But seriously, she was terrorizing them- are we to believe that no one else was bleeding? SERIOUSLY? I've actually thought about this one, If all the vampire was attacking was wolf people, and they bled, they would smell horrible, but It she cut herself since she wasn't a wolf person, then she would have smelled amazing to her.
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limelightqueen
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Post by limelightqueen on Dec 20, 2010 11:29:42 GMT -8
But it says the chief was the only wolf-person left, so if the chief's wife wasn't a wolf person we can assume all the other people that she attacked weren't wolf-people either. Thus, they didn't stink.
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Post by thewizardofoz on Feb 1, 2011 15:08:55 GMT -8
(whistles The Battle Hymn of the Republic)
Oh, hi, guys! Thank you for stopping by today, because I now have a veritable plethora of Civil War myths! These are not just ordinary ones, either; no, these are Twilight ones!
So, let's start simply and with the Mexican War and the Civil War.
According to the Twilight Wiki, Jasper was rescuing schoolchildren and the elderly from Union raids in Houston, Texas in 1863. However, there's a glitch. For starters, every man, woman, and child was expected to serve at the homefront as well as on the battlefield, whether they were able to serve or not (this depended on gender, social status, and age). Whole households were stocked with ammo, especially the farther west you went. So, it wasn't like World War I or II when soldiers and infantrymen evacuated entire countrysides in Europe. Everyone was armed to the teeth with stuff that could have obliterated a small hillside. There were no convoys because the South could barely afford to pay its soldiers. So, when the Union attacked, everyone was prepared. Imagine how shocked they must have felt when they raged hell through the fields, only to be completely destroyed by the entire town!
So, apparently, the Southern Vampire Wars were supposed to mimic the Civil War, and later on, the Mexican War. There's a problem with this. The Mexican War lasted from 1846 to 1848, fifteen to thirteen years before the Civil War began in Virginia, and seventeen to fifteen years before Jasper Whitlock Hale allegedly showed up for battle! So much for symbolism and historical allusions, especially when you consider the latter part of the S.V.W.* was fought in Mexico.
And now that that's squared away...
ALICE WAS BORN IN 1901, LIVED UNTIL THE PRESENT DAY, AND LIVED IN THE FUCKING SOUTH, AND ABSOLUTELY NO MENTION OF THE CIVIL WAR NOR HER SOUTHERN HERITAGE WAS EVER BROUGHT UP!
...Seriously? As long as fifty years after the Civil War, everyone in the South's mindsets ranged from consternation to rage, and emotions were still very raw. It formally ended once integration became mainstream and the baby boomers' children of the South learned their lesson and vowed to never repeat the same mistakes of their parents. Why does Alice never bring anything like this up or even mention it? Fifty long hours of waiting in that hotel room in Phoenix, and they never even talk, about anything! (That's a plot hole of its own merit, but we can just chalk that up as a Bella moment: She was too dumb to think of anything to say. XD)
Do we know what Edward thinks of it? Or Rosalie? Or even Emmett? How about Esme? Carlisle?! He lived through the damn thing; did he send munitions and money to the Union soldiers?!
And, of course, Bella does not give a shit because she's bored stiff through school. (Pun intended.)
I wonder what Jacob would think of it? Good God, now my mind's running...
Anyway, good to see you folks again, and I'll be back tomorrow. See you next time! (waves hands and smiles)
*Southern Vampire Wars
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Post by Blue Suede Shoes on Feb 1, 2011 17:54:15 GMT -8
Great post. ...Seriously? As long as fifty years after the Civil War, everyone in the South's mindsets ranged from consternation to rage, and emotions were still very raw. For the record, I grew up in the South (Tennessee) and some people still felt pretty angry and raw when I was a kid. I'm only twenty-seven. The Civil War (a.k.a. "War of Northern Aggression") was kind of the war that kept on going in the minds of some people. Not everyone, of course. But there's no way Alice would have been unaffected in her time period.
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limelightqueen
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Post by limelightqueen on Feb 2, 2011 11:30:58 GMT -8
Goddamn, that's the worst civil war fallacy I've heard since December when the guys on the radio said the last civil war vet died a few years ago. Let's say that vet was only 15 when he signed up for the last year of the war. If he died say, five years ago, he would have been 156 years old.
I actually remember the story they were talking about though. It was that the last widow of a civil war vet had died- some 20-something year old who married an 80 year old vet in the 1920s and then lived into her late nineties.
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Post by Sad-Eyed Sinatra on Feb 4, 2011 12:55:45 GMT -8
I'm sorry if this has already been mentioned, but it bothers me so much I must have a rant.
Why the FUCK are the Volturi afraid of being "found out" by the humans? If humans are completely defenseless and, like, can't kill vampires EVER, there'sjustnofuckingway, why do the Volturi go to such great lengths to keep the sparklepires' existence a secret? It can't be that the humans will retaliate (lol, since vampires are INVINCIBEL!!!1apple!!1 lololol suck it antis), so why is it? DON'T... GET....!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2011 14:37:46 GMT -8
I'm sorry if this has already been mentioned, but it bothers me so much I must have a rant. Why the FUCK are the Volturi afraid of being "found out" by the humans? If humans are completely defenseless and, like, can't kill vampires EVER, there'sjustnofuckingway, why do the Volturi go to such great lengths to keep the sparklepires' existence a secret? It can't be that the humans will retaliate (lol, since vampires are INVINCIBEL!!!1apple!!1 lololol suck it antis), so why is it? DON'T... GET....! Edward said "Humans now have weapons that can kill vampires", but never specified what they are (BUT THEY'RE NOT WOOD OKAY BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE DUMB AND STUFF). So I'm assuming the only way for a normal human to kill a Meyerpire would be to bomb it or something. seriously people dont make your creatures so superior and invincible sure make them powerful as fuck and ream humanity a new one if thats how you roll but for the love of tits give them some goddamn weaknesses and let us puny hoomans get some shots in there pwease
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Post by thewizardofoz on Feb 5, 2011 14:06:30 GMT -8
All of the material in quotations was quoted from my thread: tsdcv3.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=twilightcha&action=display&thread=451&page=1gaffa: Please see T_C's response, for it is epic. T_C: I'll be happy to answer a few of your questions with some of my opinions, quoted for good measure. Apparently, in Twilight, Meyer mentioned that: However, there are some problems with this. For starters, since when is venom flammable? And also, that sentence structure is bizarre. Does the fire cut him up into little pieces? That would answer a whole set of questions! Let's go with that, I guess. ( shrugs) If anyone still has any questions about the Volturi, here ya go: I'm sorry if this has already been mentioned, but it bothers me so much I must have a rant. Why the FUCK are the Volturi afraid of being "found out" by the humans? If humans are completely defenseless and, like, can't kill vampires EVER, there'sjustnofuckingway, why do the Volturi go to such great lengths to keep the sparklepires' existence a secret? It can't be that the humans will retaliate (lol, since vampires are INVINCIBEL!!!1apple!!1 lololol suck it antis), so why is it? DON'T... GET....! Gaffa, I'd like to answer your questions in segments, using my material in quotations. And that's why the Volturi are wasting away in Volterra rather than getting off their arses and doing anything useful. Thank God for that. XD
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Post by Sad-Eyed Sinatra on Feb 5, 2011 17:28:21 GMT -8
Edward said "Humans now have weapons that can kill vampires", but never specified what they are (BUT THEY'RE NOT WOOD OKAY BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE DUMB AND STUFF). So I'm assuming the only way for a normal human to kill a Meyerpire would be to bomb it or something. seriously people dont make your creatures so superior and invincible sure make them powerful as fuck and ream humanity a new one if thats how you roll but for the love of tits give them some goddamn weaknesses and let us puny hoomans get some shots in there pwease [/quote] Oh, I see. I didn't realize that Edward said that, since he spammed the entire first book with "WE VAMPIRES ARE THE PERFECT PREDATORS, AS IF YOU COULD OUTRUN ME, AS IF YOU COULD FIGHT ME OFF HURR DURR". Well, there he goes again, being so damn contradictory. First the meyerpires are invincible, then they're not. Thank you for clarifying.
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 6, 2011 15:08:48 GMT -8
They're not quite invincible... Just so near as makes no difference.
Now, cutting up and lighting on fire, how'd they get that? Did some humans try out all kinds of different methods? Did they try everything? Suppose the method's something ridiculous, like stuffing carrots down the vampire's ears and nose? How do they know that doesn't kill them?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2011 15:12:35 GMT -8
^ Cut-n-burn only works for other Meyerpires and Meyershifters who have the strength to do it. Humans apparently can't, as we are weak and stupid.
gaffa - You're welcome. Yeah, it was pretty easy to miss, he just kinda slipped it in there. OMG WE ARE SO AWESOME AND FASTER THAN THE SPEED OF SOUND AND STRONGER THAN THE HULK AND SPARKLY AND TOTES THE BEST PREDATOR EVAR AND SUPERIOR TO HOOMANS IN EVERY WAY but pls dont tell anyone cuzyouguyshavesoemweaponsthatcankillusnowokthnx. And stupidly enough IT WAS NEVER MENTIONED AGAIN. Bella didn't even ask what kind of weapons were dangerous to vampires, simply because Meyer didn't want to bother thinking of any.
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 6, 2011 15:29:21 GMT -8
Well, some of them are fairly self-explanatory. Flamethrowers, grenades, the guillotine... Not the most portable weapon, the guillotine, but still.
Also, I think you could do some serious damage to them with various medieval siege weapons. Certainly the Hwacha.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2011 18:57:49 GMT -8
This is from the Second Short Life of Bree Tanner...
The ferry massacre. No mention of it in Eclipse. Nada. On 9/11 people got cell phone messages out about what was happening, both in the buildings and the planes. No one on the ferry did? No bodies were found with mysterious wounds? Nothing?
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Tim Willard
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Post by Tim Willard on Feb 7, 2011 2:41:23 GMT -8
I"m sorry, it shows that Meyers never did any research at all.
Ever seen what a .50 cal does? Ol' Ma Duece can fuck some shit up.
Meyer expects me to believe that a .50 cal wouldn't harm one of her precious vampires? That a weapon capable of tearing a car to pieces, that can blow through a wall six cinderblocks thick, that is used to destroy enemy vehicles and buildings, wouldn't do anything but strike sparks and flatten against their sparkly skin? But yet Meyerpires can tear each other apart?
How about a 20mm or 30mm chaingun?
Sorry, but I refuse to believe that Meyerpires can Meyerwolves can hurt each other, but high velocity full metal jacket rounds won't do anything. Since she didn't depend on the supernatural, but instead decided to go the whole "SCIENCE!" route, then her speshul widdle cweations don't have any protections.
Of course, if asked, she'll just say that Edward the Lame was talking about nukes.
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 7, 2011 16:44:31 GMT -8
I"m sorry, it shows that Meyers never did any research at all.
Ever seen what a .50 cal does? Ol' Ma Duece can fuck some shit up.
Meyer expects me to believe that a .50 cal wouldn't harm one of her precious vampires? That a weapon capable of tearing a car to pieces, that can blow through a wall six cinderblocks thick, that is used to destroy enemy vehicles and buildings, wouldn't do anything but strike sparks and flatten against their sparkly skin? But yet Meyerpires can tear each other apart?
How about a 20mm or 30mm chaingun?
Sorry, but I refuse to believe that Meyerpires can Meyerwolves can hurt each other, but high velocity full metal jacket rounds won't do anything. Since she didn't depend on the supernatural, but instead decided to go the whole "SCIENCE!" route, then her speshul widdle cweations don't have any protections.
Of course, if asked, she'll just say that Edward the Lame was talking about nukes.
Of course she wouldn't do research. That would take work, taking precious time away from writing about how Edwart's so Adonis-like.
Honestly, I refuse to believe they can hurt each other, but even a nice bomb can't. I have a hard time believing the Cullens weren't all wiped out in one of the World Wars.
While we're at it, how DID a family with up to FOUR- count 'em, FOUR- able-bodied young men, apparently US citizens barring any information to the contrary, escape various war drafts? Wouldn't DOCTOR Carlisle, with his compassion and all, WANT to help in Vietnam or WWII? And why is this NEVER mentioned? I mean, feel free to tell me if it is, but you'd think that would be, I dunno, noteworthy?
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Post by Lady Phoenix on Feb 7, 2011 17:03:06 GMT -8
You know, removing the vampire's head should be adequate enough.
I mean, there's a reason why people always say you should shoot zombies in the HEAD and that decapitation is the ONLY way to kill a Highlander . . .
The brain is the MAIN CONTROL SYSTEM, it controls the breathing, pulse rate, sight, movement, and just about everything else -- take it away the it all crumbles down.
It don't see the point in tearing the body and then burning it if you just decapitate the guy because once the nerves are severed -- the body can't get any messages to actually move and do anything.
OH sure, you'll sometimes see a zombie's arm climb around -- but it's usually for the sake of comedy or the fact the zombie is created by MAGIC rather than disease/radiation. When they're controlled by magic, the wizards usually act as the brain for the zombie and can make any part move since she's the puppet master.
The Meyerpires are made into vampires by NATURAL causes, however, and not magic. Therefore, their own brains still have to relay messages to the undead bodies to do anything.
So, WHY CAN'T WE JUST DECAPITATE THEM?! Why do we have to go the extra mile to kill them? It does not make sense and no scientific BS Meyer can pull out of her ass can explain such scientific bullshit.
That, in itself, is a gaping plothole -- that humans can't just kill them by taking a hunking big, mithril sword to kill them.
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Post by Lady Phoenix on Feb 7, 2011 17:03:50 GMT -8
. . . Did I just explain fictional monsters with real science?
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 7, 2011 18:07:38 GMT -8
. . . Did I just explain fictional monsters with real science? Yes you did. And really, if the only way to kill a species is two methods that are over-the-top ridiculous on their own, anything that needs both ought to be a god, or the series-arcing big bad.
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Post by Lady Phoenix on Feb 7, 2011 18:14:04 GMT -8
. . . Did I just explain fictional monsters with real science? Yes you did. And really, if the only way to kill a species is two methods that are over-the-top ridiculous on their own, anything that needs both ought to be a god, or the series-arcing big bad. Agreed.
The problem is they are not. They are our heroes, and that makes them sues.
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Post by vampirekites on Feb 7, 2011 19:26:59 GMT -8
RE: Only way humans can kill meyerpires is with advanced weapons. Even this could be avoided since almost all meyerpires have some sort of special power. Someone like Alice might be able to predict if a nuclear war is imminent and another with mind control can make a person not go through with it. Since they are so super special, I'm sure they could find a way to avoid any conflict with humans even if humans did find out about them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 8, 2011 16:32:51 GMT -8
Yeah, so basically it just cancels itself out.
Also, I gues the way they came to the conclusion of ripping-to-shreds-and-burning is because it seems like a pretty sure-fire way to deal with, well, anything. (Apart from removing the fucking head, but Meyerpires don't meyerpire that way). You know, kill it with fire and all that.
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 9, 2011 17:35:59 GMT -8
I still wanna know how the Cullens all managed to avoid multiple drafts.
Also, I figured out why decapitation wouldn't work on them: They have no brains.
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gisbon
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Post by gisbon on Feb 9, 2011 18:03:27 GMT -8
RE: Only way humans can kill meyerpires is with advanced weapons. Even this could be avoided since almost all meyerpires have some sort of special power. Someone like Alice might be able to predict if a nuclear war is imminent and another with mind control can make a person not go through with it. Since they are so super special, I'm sure they could find a way to avoid any conflict with humans even if humans did find out about them. I wanna see Alice predict an A-10 Warthog. I really do.
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Post by Blue Suede Shoes on Feb 9, 2011 18:10:31 GMT -8
I still wanna know how the Cullens all managed to avoid multiple drafts. It's possible that their fake documentation also falsely lists them as medically unfit for combat. Of course, that wouldn't explain why a draft board wouldn't ask questions about why all the males in the family happen to be medically unfit, or why Carlisle wouldn't be recruited for a stateside military medical facility at the very least...
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Post by vampirekites on Feb 9, 2011 18:19:09 GMT -8
RE: Only way humans can kill meyerpires is with advanced weapons. Even this could be avoided since almost all meyerpires have some sort of special power. Someone like Alice might be able to predict if a nuclear war is imminent and another with mind control can make a person not go through with it. Since they are so super special, I'm sure they could find a way to avoid any conflict with humans even if humans did find out about them. I wanna see Alice predict an A-10 Warthog. I really do.
Ha! Well, in essence she couldn't predict the thing itself, but whoever decides to use it. Plus, there might be another meyerpire with dead on predictions skills that would see anyone using a fighter plane to drop a couple of bombs or ammunition on them. Since they are so OMG super fast, they could just literally run away from it.
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Chibithulhu
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Post by Chibithulhu on Feb 9, 2011 18:37:29 GMT -8
I still wanna know how the Cullens all managed to avoid multiple drafts. It's possible that their fake documentation also falsely lists them as medically unfit for combat. Of course, that wouldn't explain why a draft board wouldn't ask questions about why all the males in the family happen to be medically unfit, or why Carlisle wouldn't be recruited for a stateside military medical facility at the very least... Or why the guy who's apparently compassionate and is resistant to human blood would do so, least before Edwart and Esme joined in.
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