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Post by Lord Lovrina on Dec 20, 2010 8:42:33 GMT -8
Wait, what? So just because it contains magic, it's promoting the occult and by extension Satanism? Woah. That's pretty much the whole fantasy genre screwed then. I know some Christians at my college that said their church leaders won't let them read fantasy or horror for the same reasons people go nuts over HP. I think the only thing that sets them off is that it is about wizards because I get the same thing whenever I ATTEMPT to write about wizards. It has nothing to do with Christianity. I'm a Christian and I don't think HP is sending out super evil messages.
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Darth Pichu
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Man ist was man isst[Mo0:4]
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Post by Darth Pichu on Dec 20, 2010 8:46:51 GMT -8
I read the articles in question a few months ago - linked from the old TS forum. I assumed it was fake. And joking about the morals of a children's story aside, since when has posting a link to a "biased" artice/site ever warranted "nexttimewe'llcometoyourfrontdoor" warning? That and joking? I guess Harry Potter is srs business here? =P Joking aside that's a little disconcerting if you ask me. =/ I mean, not that I'm all for branding Harry Potter a tool of the devil into the minds of impressionable young children, but even so, I thought part of TS was being able to state your opinion, whatever that opinion happens to be. You just have to be able to defend it with all you've got once its out there. Didn't know you could get warnings for it too.
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Post by Admin on Dec 21, 2010 1:32:12 GMT -8
It's one thing to actually state your opinion (and defend it as needed), it's another thing to play Devil's Advocate and argue for an opinion that isn't yours.
It's a whole new ballgame to make a mockery of Devil's Advocacy.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 21, 2010 6:00:59 GMT -8
Is it ok if I post a link to an article about Christian symbolism in Harry Potter?
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limelightqueen
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You know how to whistle, don't you?[Mo0:0]
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Post by limelightqueen on Dec 21, 2010 9:36:10 GMT -8
Anya, that sounds both appropriate and interesting. Please do.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 21, 2010 19:43:43 GMT -8
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Post by stevelysteve on Dec 23, 2010 1:12:21 GMT -8
.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 23, 2010 7:13:20 GMT -8
^I sort of agree. It's easy to think the series might be bad if you've never read it, but once you actually read it, it's kinda obvious that it's not (IMO at least)
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Post by Prime Spinosaur on Dec 27, 2010 9:28:08 GMT -8
So it's just like with D&D, where people(Christians mostly) thought that such people were going things like this... It's so silly it's not even funny. But I'm not here to talk about D&D. I think most of these claims are attributed to ignorance, arrogance, and even simply fear, would that be correct?
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Captain Victoria
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My oolong heals, and your dealer deals for quite a hefty fee. So I self-medicate with tea.[Mo0:13]
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Post by Captain Victoria on Dec 27, 2010 12:40:26 GMT -8
So it's just like with D&D, where people(Christians mostly) thought that such people were going things like this... *clipp'd* It's so silly it's not even funny. But I'm not here to talk about D&D. I think most of these claims are attributed to ignorance, arrogance, and even simply fear, would that be correct? How paranoid and joyless is your life if you fear that Harry Potter promotes witchcraft?
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~vola!
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I am Rasputin. Let me draw you in. Take this evil grin and love me for my sins.[Mo0:10]
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Post by ~vola! on Dec 27, 2010 13:26:51 GMT -8
I'm pretty sure this is where the "Harry Potter is evil!!" hysteria originated:
Astute readers will note that this article is from The Onion, which is not now nor has it ever been a serious news source.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 27, 2010 21:44:52 GMT -8
I'm pretty sure this is where the "Harry Potter is evil!!" hysteria originated:
Astute readers will note that this article is from The Onion, which is not now nor has it ever been a serious news source.
That's insanely stupid... Things mentioned in that article but not in the books:
-Satanism -Satanic symbols like pentagrams -Summoning dark spirits -Jesus
Also, the so-called "quote" at the end is nothing JKR would ever say, being a Christian herself.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2010 22:36:08 GMT -8
I'm pretty sure this is where the "Harry Potter is evil!!" hysteria originated:
Astute readers will note that this article is from The Onion, which is not now nor has it ever been a serious news source.
That's insanely stupid... Things mentioned in that article but not in the books:
-Satanism -Satanic symbols like pentagrams -Summoning dark spirits -Jesus
Also, the so-called "quote" at the end is nothing JKR would ever say, being a Christian herself.Dude, it's The Onion. It's not serious in the slightest.
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samedi
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Post by samedi on Dec 27, 2010 23:52:55 GMT -8
It's one thing to actually state your opinion (and defend it as needed), it's another thing to play Devil's Advocate and argue for an opinion that isn't yours.
It's a whole new ballgame to make a mockery of Devil's Advocacy. My opinion wasn't actually made apparent, and any action to elaborate was ruthlessly crushed under pain of death(I'm assuming, since I don't know the nature of the warning). What exactly did I do to warrant a warning? Whether hardcore christian parents are indeed concerned about a child's storybook is irrelevant seeing as the articles that sparked this debate aren't serious at all. I withdraw from this "debate", though funnily enough, the one-sidedness of said debate reminds me of a witchburning.
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2010 2:02:52 GMT -8
My opinion wasn't actually made apparent, and any action to elaborate was ruthlessly crushed under pain of death(I'm assuming, since I don't know the nature of the warning). On the contrary, your opinion was very apparent from your initial posts. You thought it was all a big joke.
Besides posting as though you held a particular stance while simultaneously mocking it? You'd have to ask Fujiko.
That it is the very topic of discussion makes it highly relevant to this topic.
While the Onion article was not serious, keep in mind that they parody the news. The debacle was going on well before the Onion did anything with it. Harry Potter was already under fire a good year prior, and that's just considering when it was being blocked from select libraries due to the controversy.
The trouble, however, is that the matter is very much grounded in personal morality, which means one side will likely never agree with the other.
Contrary to the general attitude of posters in this topic thus far, the other side does have some valid points, but the outcome will vary depending on personal morality.
A one-sidedness that you, yourself, helped fuel.
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samedi
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Post by samedi on Dec 28, 2010 3:09:54 GMT -8
Very well, I apologise for derailing the topic.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2010 9:20:38 GMT -8
it may make some people uncomfortable to think of young kids running around playing make believe as witches and wizards doing magic when it's clearly against their beliefs. A) It is your beliefs, not theirs. B) You're children obviously do not see magic in the same way you do, if they read Harry Potter and play pretend wizards. They do not think witches are the spawn of the devil or wish to see a thousand years of pain and misery on earth. Therefor, it's pretty damn stupid to start feeling uncomfortable about it. The only reason parents should kick up a fuss when their child starts playing "witchcraft" is if they try to sacrafice the neighbours cat. EDIT: These are all hypothetical yous, mind.
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Fyra [AiLH]
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And they're turnin' us into monsters... turnin' us into fire...[Mo0:1]
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Post by Fyra [AiLH] on Dec 28, 2010 13:15:46 GMT -8
I always thought that vampires were against God because they chose to live forever and not die.
Harry Potter promotes quite strongly in the last few books that death is nothing to be feared. Look where it got Tom Riddle.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 28, 2010 19:50:16 GMT -8
I always thought that vampires were against God because they chose to live forever and not die. Harry Potter promotes quite strongly in the last few books that death is nothing to be feared. Look where it got Tom Riddle.
I'm not sure what you're trying to say here. Care to clarify?
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~vola!
Member
I am Rasputin. Let me draw you in. Take this evil grin and love me for my sins.[Mo0:10]
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Post by ~vola! on Dec 28, 2010 20:13:36 GMT -8
That's insanely stupid... Things mentioned in that article but not in the books:
-Satanism -Satanic symbols like pentagrams -Summoning dark spirits -Jesus
Also, the so-called "quote" at the end is nothing JKR would ever say, being a Christian herself.Dude, it's The Onion. It's not serious in the slightest.
Like I said:
Astute readers will note that this article is from The Onion, which is not now nor has it ever been a serious news source.
Also, this kind of satire (read: taking a believable premise and making shit up to get a rise out of dumb people) is the bread and butter of The Onion. Successful troll is successful.[/b][/size][/color][/font]
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Post by Anya the Purple on Dec 28, 2010 20:30:26 GMT -8
^Oh, sorry. I'd never heard of the Onion before...
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Post by Admin on Dec 28, 2010 21:02:52 GMT -8
I always thought that vampires were against God because they chose to live forever and not die. It runs much deeper than that, actually.
Especially since in most European lore, vampirism wasn't voluntary. It came about due to a curse or the body being indwelt by not exactly friendly spirits due to an improper burial.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2010 23:22:33 GMT -8
I don't know, I once read a Dobby/Neville slash fic that was pretty unholy. ;D
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 30, 2010 9:18:58 GMT -8
So basically, if I pretend to hex people I'm going to hell?
All joking aside, I've always found this argument ridiculous. I think that most of the people who write articles claiming that Harry Potter is Satanic haven't even bothered to read the books. If they read the books, they would realize that Harry Potter is anything but evil.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2010 14:15:25 GMT -8
So basically, if I pretend to hex people I'm going to hell?
All joking aside, I've always found this argument ridiculous. I think that most of the people who write articles claiming that Harry Potter is Satanic haven't even bothered to read the books. If they read the books, they would realize that Harry Potter is anything but evil. This. i'm still confused on why that churchhates Harry Potter, but loves Twilight? Obviously somethings wrong with their brains.
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Post by iamnotbellagoth on Jan 19, 2011 5:42:40 GMT -8
Hi I understand why people would hate Harry Potter judging by the fact that it's about witches and wizards and magic, which is considered evil. I am Christian and I am extremely in love with the the books because it's such a lovable well written story, which is fiction and fantasy. It hasn't changed the way I feel about God or my religion, and I don't see why it should as it's a whole different world inside a book with so many lessons that I can take from it. It doesn't teach witchcraft or anything, which is the fantasy part about it, but it goes deeper with lessons about friendship, love and death. I think people who judge it by the fact that it's to do with magic stay away from it because of this reason, so they don't really know what they're talking about when it comes to Harry Potter. That's just what I think anyway.
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Post by Anya the Purple on Jan 19, 2011 20:51:51 GMT -8
^I agree. Also, the magic used in the Harry Potter series is very different from the magic used in Wicca and the modern-day occult (not that there's anything wrong with them in my opinion, but it seems there is in the minds of some people). I'd hardly say that shouting in Latin has anything to do with Satan.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 20, 2011 13:09:31 GMT -8
I can understand why some Christians are concerned about Harry Potter, just because of the witches and wizards. I am a Christian (Catholic, to be more specific) and I think that there is no harm in the series. The magic in it is nothing but fantasy, and is not similar at all to Wicca or Paganism.
Personally, I believe Christians have bigger things to be concerned about than a fantasy book series. Shouldn't we be trying to help people, for example the Japanese earthquake victims, rather than worrying about "Oh my gosh, the fictional wizards are corrupting our innocent children to Satanism?"
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makoeyes
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I AM LUCIFER GOD OF THE UNDERWORLD AND I WANT YOUR SOUL!
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Post by makoeyes on Apr 22, 2012 18:42:08 GMT -8
I've ALWAYS been baffled at these accusations. I wonder if these people ahve ever read the books. The magic in the series is entirely fictional. It bears no resemblance to real life occult practices. When was the last time a Harry Potter character casts a magic circle or summon a demon? Never. It doesn't bear any resemblance to Satanism, or Wicca for that matter. In fact, I'd argue it's a Christian allegory. Jo herself is a Christian and she's admitted that the religious parallels are obvius to her. Here's part of what started it all: www.theonion.com/articles/harry-potter-books-spark-rise-in-satanism-among-ch,2413/ WARNING: Lulz will ensue. So it's just like with D&D, where people(Christians mostly) thought that such people were going things like this... It's so silly it's not even funny. But I'm not here to talk about D&D. I think most of these claims are attributed to ignorance, arrogance, and even simply fear, would that be correct? Bwahaha Chick Tracts! XD I always thought that vampires were against God because they chose to live forever and not die. It's far worse than that. They kill people to feed themselves.
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makoeyes
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Post by makoeyes on Apr 22, 2012 20:02:46 GMT -8
Whoops double post.
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